QUESTIONS from our readers...
Param Vinay thhi moksha chhe
Absolute humility leads to freedom
Further questions from Francesco....
Hello Shudda. Let's see:
...the "I" in Francesco is separated from the worldly Franscesco.
HOW? IS THIS A POTENTIALLY DANGEROUS PROCESS?
In your answer you didn't really address my question. I understand all the facts that you've expounded.
I had attempted to answer the issue of danger that you raise in the previous response. This science of The Gnani has multifaceted results. For the one who seeks a happy worldly life, Pujya Dadashri has given Vyavahaar Vignan...the science of worldly interaction. And for the one who wants to find permanent freedom even as he lives a worldly life , he gives the knowledge of The Self...Akram Vignan. Akram itself denotes the new direct stepless path without any traditional order of meditation, rituals, renunciation, yoga practices, fasts, reclusive activities and vows.
The separation is internal. It is a pure knowledge process. It is not a physical process. It is the establishment of the eternal truth within you that you are not really Francesco. Francesco is indeed the name with which the world identifies this body within which you are a temporary traveler. You are permanent but your stay within this body is temporary and finite. Why get so involved with that which you will not be able to take with you when you leave? The only things which will come with you are the causes and the causal wishes that you have created in this life with your causal body for the next life. These express as attachment and abhorrence in your next life. If indeed you do not believe in a life after this current life then we should stop right here, and have nothing further talk about this AV. It boils down to the issue of whether Fransceco is reading these words on the computer screen or you are reading them. Or are you aware of Franscesco reading them?
The danger lies in not recognizing these words of The Gnani that in every life event ,every moment you are creating a causal body for next life through the inner intent called bhaav...which results in attachment and abhorrence, likes and dislikes ...in the next life, and for that you have no control what so ever. So even if you want to stay away from what the world calls "sinful" in this life, you will not be able to do so, because you simply have not understood the science behind this. The danger lies creating the situation life after life where in ignorance ( of the fact as to who you really are ) you bind yourself by cementing your opinions about what is pleasure and what is painful. Does a person chose whether he gets to be born in Kosovo or Ethiopia? Whether to be born in a Catholic family or a Jewish family? Does anyone ask him whether they can name him Francesco when he is born? Or for that matter for the average person what difference does it make whether Bush or Gore wins the White House? It is only after he gets brainwashed into liking or disliking a certain candidate by the media that he starts taking sides and have opinions which are entrenched by his ego. Prior to the party nominations no one had heard their names in other countries. Now they sit glued to the TV sets hoping that their candidate wins. What made it their candidate? Their opinion of like and dislike. Why? They hardly know them !
All the Gnani does in the Gnan Vidhi is to bring back the ego from the wrong place...I am Francesco... to the right, the original place...I am Pure Soul. The Five sentences given by him after the Vidhi are to be applied to uphold this newly realized enlightened world view. From this view bliss ensues in all situations of life...pleasant or unpleasant.
If the issue of danger is a concern for danger that is created from a sense of pacifism and politics of relativism, e.g., " it is all karma and whatever happens is correct and let the massacre in other nations continue...it is their karma, " then the answer is simply that it is not AV. AV also emphasizes that through these thoughts speech and acts not a single living being must be hurt. You have seen the nine cardinal sentences of The Gnani on the web ..called the essence of all scriptures at the main web site called www.dadshri.org.
The false notion that the "I" in Francesco is the doer of anything in this world is removed. The real "I" does not do anything. All worldly interactions happen. Francesco's world continues even as You step away from it.
.... 5 Agnas after the vidhi. These give you protection so that you will not slip or lose the experience of the Self that you have acquired in the vidhi.
BUT IF PREVIOUS KARMAS ARE NOT ERASED HOW CAN I NOT SLIP BACK?
Very thoughtful question indeed.
The fire of the Knowledge of The Gnan Vidhi burns all your karma. Those that unfold are the ones which now belong to Francesco, not you. ..... Only the ones that you have carried forward from your past life, charged in your past life ,express as discharge in this life and are ready to unfold as you live the rest of your life.
I don't get this. If they are burnt as you state above, how can they still unfold?
If there are no karma there will not be a body. You will attain final liberation, nirvana, moksha. The exact statement should have been as follows.
The Gnani burns the sins of endless previous lives in the Gnan Vidhi. The Gnani Purush Dadashri himself in his frail older age fell down while visiting a holy place with a bunch of mahatmas and sustained a hip fracture. This was Ambalal Patel's karma unfolding. The difference was that he did not suffer the pain of the prolonged recovery from the bed rest which was the treatment for him. Ramana Maharashi had a painful cancer in his arm and had a similar response to pain. They are aware of the pain but they do not suffer the pain. The karma of past life will unfold until you leave the current body and the karma of this life will unfold until you leave the next body of the next life. The fire of Knowledge of The Self burns all the karma...here effects... of ignorance of the Self. What remains for you to deal with after the Gnan Vidhi is those karma that unfold in front of you who now is separate from Francesco.
You are correct. If you are separated from the karma of Francesco, then they are indeed Francesco's karma not yours. That is the Gnan. With grace and agna application the separation remains especially in painful situations in life that unfolds.
If you slip back and say end up "doing" something that you should not have done, the Awakened Self within ,will warn you, Francesco that you have slipped and not You...who is free and pure. Francesco's regrets and repentances then are noted by You, who continues to rise above all human fallacies and trials.
But this does not sound like integration, which is the full result of what you are describing. An awakened person should be an integrated one.
This is indeed the of beauty of AV. Your comment has deep insight in a very complex problem of all paths of Self realization. This human body is the only vehicle through which this is possible. If you were a dog or a lion or a divine celestial being in the heavens you will not be able to escape the cycle of causes and effects life after life. Even as a human being, only the highly elevated spiritual souls get to pause in their life and ask a question...who am I? And amongst these only the most blessed ones find the an experiential answer that liberates them from this endless cycle of birth and death.
You had asked in your first few questions about why this science is not known to the world? Well, the old science has always existed. The traditional path of scriptures, self study, renunciation, yoga, and deep meditation....is the main path. It is a very tough path. And it is unlikely to meet with any success in current era where human beings do not have unity of thoughts, speech and acts.
You are quite correct in your view that an awakened person should be an integrated one. This integration on the path of Self realization requires unity in thought, speech and acts. This is an impossibility in this era of human life. So for example even if you are nice to your friend and his wife externally and behaving properly, you may have vicarious desires and thoughts about his wife which is the lack of integration. How will you be free from this inner lack of harmony? Or you may have purity of intent and feelings towards her but by strange turn of events you end up sleeping with her. Where is the integration here? All traditional religions that command that thou shall not do this...or that, are the ones that burden the modern man with this dictum of integration where it simply is not possible. That is why they fail man. They run to the confessional only to find later that the priest they were confessing to had a more wicked personal life. This is where Akram Vignan enters. This is where The Gnani comes with the correct approach. He says that the karma of the past life are going to unfold as they have been caused. Exactly as they have been created. They were created in ignorance. They have to be seen as they unfold with knowledge. No new ones will be created if you see them instead of suffering them. Then as they gradually dissipate after unfolding you will understand what true integration is.
The Gnani Purush Dadashri has given this with the analogy of the train. In this life you are the engine and all the karma are the various railway cars that you are pulling. AV delinks you from the long train of cars behind the engine. This happens in the Vidhi. The freedom felt from the de-linking is immediate. At other times Pujya Dadashri has likened AV to the lift...elevator path. The concept of integration which you describe and presume is the traditional kramic path. This is a step by step path towards enlightenment where you enforce a certain conduct in thoughts, speech and acts. This is the exercise of the ego. This is where you say within, " I am Francesco and I will not lie." Is this possible ? Yes, but tough. As this happens in the prescribed method of traditional scriptures, you rise spiritually within until the final step , purifying the external, the thoughts, speech and acts to the point where the ego leaves and you become enlightened. In Akram Vignan on the other hand the Gnani purifies you first and then you are left free to observe the impurities or purities that unfold. There is no sense of doer ship involved and so like an elevator you reach the top floor of a fourteen story building without climbing all the stairs.
Integration is recognizing the fact that there is no integration and to have a healthy respect for that being the cause of all suffering, internal and external.
You are simply asked to repeat special sentences of The Akram Vignani which separate you from that which is the non self...
ARE THESE MANTRAS? HOW CAN THERE NOT BE TRANSFER OF SOME SORT OF ENERGY OR ACTION UPON THE SUBTLE BODIES TO BRING ABOUT AND KEEP THE CHANGE?
As said above these sentences have the unparallel and explosive effect of separating this sense that I am Franscesco and bringing you back to the Supreme Truth that You are the Pure Self...which is eternal.
From my training in meditation this does sound like mantra. I don't know of anything else that, as you say, can be "explosive"
So far do you know of any mantra that is an eternal fact? The intellect will accept it as fact but will it reside within the core of your being and in the heart and give you the experience of the Self? If they do then such words are explosive.
Having used the term explosive, please do not let me misguide you into expecting the experience of something explosive. Explosive is the effect of the separation from current idea that I am Francesco. The disconnection is at a very subtle level. The enlightenment is of the One who is awakened not the worldly Francesco who still has to go about his daily life. This bond and tie to the idea that 'I am Francesco' , life after life is so strong that nothing short of an explosion will work.
This energy is the energy of The Gnani Purush. It is the miracle of miracles of this modern era. This energy is the unfolding of the exact energy within you, which increases day by day as you get to know The Gnani.
No. This energy is beyond the limitations of thoughts, speech and acts. Kundalini is the process at the physical plane. Elaborated in detail in scriptures and hardly experienced by a few. Little is known whether its effects are lasting. I may be harsh in the words here, but what good is the carrot stick before a donkey? I want the results that I can experience now. If the transient and beneficial effects of meditation were cumulative, and therefore let one rise spiritually, then it would be worthwhile. Human life time is simply too short. And hence the critical need to go where the money is.
Those who laugh and deride it will not see it for what it is...the easy way out of what is otherwise a very uphill battle for moksh.
I don't think it's a laughing matter but you must admit it's nowhere mentioned or reported that moksh is so easy to obtain.
Moksh is indeed very easy. A mokshdaata...the giver of moksh is very very difficult to obtain. The world will only revert to that which is available. Scriptures and their pontification according to the view of the one reading them. Where indeed is the One who does not need any scriptures ? Find such a one and then moksh is easy.
.... worldly pleasures. Now I see them as they are. I have no likes or dislikes, or opinions left regarding such life. The bliss within prevails over these sensual passions.
Do you ever partake of and enjoy these pleasures and if so, how do you feel about it?
Yes, I do partake and enjoy them as they unfold in front of me. The desire to repeat the enjoyment is not there. There is no guilt or burden or misgiving about the enjoyment. They are being seen as remnants of unfolding karma of shuddha. Acute awareness exists in those enjoyments that represent possible dangers. In painful situations this awareness is much more easily attained. I used to enjoy alcohol and non vegetarian food, but now I am not aware of the need to experience any pleasure from them.
Many thanks, to you Francesco
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more questions and responses
The following were the original questions of
response to the material on the web about Dadashri and Akram Vignan.
Hi and thanks about your message and interest. I have
read some of the Web pages on Akram Vigyan but I still don't quite get what the
practice is all about.
1) What is vidhi ?
It is the scientific process of the Gnani in which the
real You...the "I" in Francesco is separated from the worldly Franscesco.
The seperation is an awareness that is established within you. You are currently aware that you are Francesco. After the vidhi of 48 minutes you become aware that you are pureSoul, and your identification with Franscesco is like that of a neighbor. Francesco becomes your first neighbor. You are internally separated from from the thoughts, speech and acts of Francesco. Now you are involved with the thoughts , words and acts and you say that these are my thoughts, my speech etc and after the Vidhi you become the exact observer of these thoughts and words. So a separtion has occured between that which is temporary and changing and is ultimately going to die...this body, acts, and thoughts, and the permanent , the real and the eternal which is the real you...the I in the one who says my name is Franscesco.
The vidhi is simple. You do not have to do anything. You simply have to repeat the words that The Gnani asks you to repeat. There is no transfer of any power from the Gnani to you. You are merely waking up to the exact reality of your existence in this world. That simply is Self Realization. Currently you have a false identification with Franscesco. Francesco is the name given to this body of yours, you are not Francesco. You are the divine eternal Presence within this thoughts, speech and act complex called Fransceco by the world. That divine eternal presence needs to be relaized and is the final aim of human birth.
The vidhi process also makes you realize the nature of the doer in this world. These two components, who am I? and who is running this universe? is all you need to know. This is the knowledge of liberation. This liberation is experienced after the vidhi. The vidhi is simply is a process.
There is no exchange of anything. All that is required of
you is to accept that in these matters of freedom and true internal bliss and
the science of the Self, you do not know anything and that is why you are asking
the Gnani Purush to grace you with the knowledge. You are the Lord yourself but
you do not have the key to access the infinite power and the strength of the
Lord within you. Coming back to your real Self, means coming home and this is
the dissolution of the ego. Ego is defined by the Gnani as
" I am Francesco."
There is no exchange of money and you are not required to do anything after the vidhi.
The Gnani explains five cardinal sentences and principles or key instructions for you to understand called 5 Agnas after the vidhi. These give you protection so that you will not slip or lose the experience of the Self that you have acquired in the vidhi.
There is no hypnosis, occult psychology or anything weird done in the vidhi. You are simply asked to repeat special sentences of The Akram Vignani which separate you from that which is the non self...anatma from the Self...atma. The process is extraordinary and beyond words.
The vidhi is typically done in Gujarati. Pujya Niruben
does perform it in English for some who do not know the language.
2) Is there something to do or are disciples "done", so to speak?
There is nothing to do after the above mentioned grace of
the Gnani. The disciples are done, in that their work is done. The final
knowledge has been attained. There is nothing further to do except to increase
the experience of the bliss of the Self through an aware understanding related
application of the five sentences which are cardinal. After the separation from
Franscesco, you remain in bliss and Francesco's work in daily life will be
observed as simply being done, without any hassles or friction.
3) What are the preparations involved?
There are no preparations to be done. The science is new and unique and does not call for any readines, study, spiritual practice, fasts or renunciations. All that is necessary is the arrangements to meet the Gnani and request this Gnan...the knowledge that separates you from Francesco in the Vidhi. Of course, all residual doubts must be cleared by asking as many questions as you want to, to the Gnani. You are doing the right thing. You have studied extensive material on the web.
There is nothing that you can not ask a Gnani.
4) Are there any qualifications to be fulfilled in order to qualify for "initiation", if you call it that?
Traditionally the initiation means that you will have to
follow what The Guru tells you. This is not a Guru disciple path. The Gnani
refuses to be a traditional worldly guru. He gives you your Sadguru...internal
guru. He liberates you from all worldly gurus.
On the day of the vidhi you become eternal and beyond births and deaths. Exact application of the Agnas of the Gnani will give you bliss that is of the Lord Himself. Thereafter there are no worldly instructions to follow. Those who hover around the Gnani do so out of sheer love and reverence for Him who liberates, amidst all the pains and misery of the world.
5) Is there a practice to follow after initiation?
The only practice that needs to be cultivated is the
practice of following the five agnas of the Gnani which perpetuates the Bliss of
6) Can a disciple have another guru and follow Akram Vigyan?
Absolutely yes. As mentioned above the guru is for the
relative world. The Gnani is for liberation from the relative world.
The guru will tell you to do something...The Gnani will tell you that nothing need to be done. The guru has an ego...The Gnani is egoless. If one has a guru, fine. The guru will be seen as he is in true light with the Knowledge of The Self. The Akram Vignani gave Gnan to a few religious gurus.
7) Are there any centers in Europe?
No, but the way you are asking these questions, we may have a first center in Italy in future. This science is simply very new and the world has not awakened to it yet.
8) What has your experience been of AV
and anything else you may want to add?
My words... is my experience. The real experience is
beyond words. The web site will give you glimpses of my experience.
Some of them have spilled over into my poetry for the Gnani. I am just one of the thousands who have been graced with an ever increasing bliss within...For nearly ten years now, since my awakening , I am totally free from within, free from worries, anger, greed or any persistent desires. I am the child of The Gnani. The family of the Gnani all over the world marvel at the presence of selfless love in all mahatmas...term used by the Gnani for all those who are liberated.
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Jai Sat Chit Anand
The Awareness of the Eternal is Bliss.
Last update: December 16 , 2000
Please note that the responses of shuddha
above simply represent the experience of only one of many thousands of mahatmas of The
Gnani Purush Pujya Dadashri
and are in no way intended to make any specific claims for others. They are
highly individualized and personal experiences and within the inner work of this
science all matters
that relate to inner experiences and representations are for the person
experiencing them. There is no world experience when it comes to the interaction
of the self and the Self. Precise answers are the ones that result in a
meaningful change within an individual for personal bliss and worldly peace.
Such precise experiential answers are only possible when one meets a Gnani