QUESTIONS from our readers of the web pages of Dadashri
The answers are spontaneous and from the
perspective of the experiential understanding of Akram Vignan.
The exact answers are beyond words. This will be understood once a seeker arrives and proceeds further in the scientific spirituality of Akram Vignan.
Please note that questions are in bold font. Answers are in regular non bold font. Original letters from the questioner are in blue font. Multipart questions are separated for purpose of clarity.
From: John Dear
Sir, I want
diksha or satsang with Dr, Niruben. Can I get
this in Delhi? If not, then where? I plan to
come to India soon....April. Please
give addresses and contacts. Thanks, John Dear Sir/Madam, I have been searching for Truth for
a long time. I need to go beyond words, thoughts
and practices now....I long for the direct experience of the Self. Can you lead
me to that? My life has been full of irrational
fear and depression. In deep meditation I have experienced the Bliss and peace
of the Self but only rarely. There must be a radical and massive
change within and all of these years of searching, reading and meditating have
still not led to THAT. I need awakening in and through the
presence of a realised teacher. Can you turn on the light of the
Self within? ....I am helpless
here. Dear
John: Until
you realize the Self and come to the answer of: Who am I You
have to deal with what is in front of you… through the medium of your thoughts,
speech and acts. If
you long for this experience, then it is not very far away. Please
address the issues of depression through professional channels first. That which
the body and the mind require must not be denied. If there are issues of
untreated prolonged depression and anxiety due to neurotransmitter deficiencies
these are easily corrected by a frank discussion with your doctor, just as you
would if you had high blood pressure effects or effects of diabetes. Bliss,
permanent bliss is attained after Self-realization. This does not mean that the
worldly problems cease. The way you react to them changes. In
May this year, Dr. Niruben is coming to the UK and if you let us know more about
your whereabouts and more about yourself, we will arrange for you to meet her
personally. Through
her medium you will feel that which you are seeking. With
kind regards Jai
Sat Chit Anand shuddha Dear Sir, Thanks for the advice! I do not
need it! I am seriously seeking and cannot
be satisfied with anything less than a complete and radical change.
Please forgive me, I am making no
pretense of knowing anything about the Self, Pure Consciousness or the
nature and meaning of life
itself. I have to start from here, from
what I am in life now. Also, to say that it is going to
take time to have an insight or to awaken seems to be the lazy
mans excuse for remaining asleep! One more thing... I need a
realised teacher to help me break through. All of these things have been
deeply understood...they are not just thoughts and opinions. My particular problems if you may
call them that are merely symptoms of my separation from the wholeness of life.
In quiet moments amongst nature I realise this. They are Nothing and of no value
unless they can help me to have some very special understanding of who I am. And
they are leading me to that. There may not be a clear path to
realisation. Surely Pure Consciousness is there somewhere behind the noise of
thought?
John Dear
John: You may call me shuddha. This is my web name
because I have no desire to be known or recognized. My goal is to understand and
experience that which is beyond the day-to-day life events, The Self. I have
found this in the words of Dadashri and having acquired the Gnan as he has
given, I continue to marvel at the great depths of freedom from which all bliss
stems. In conveying this to those who seek, I feel graced and
blessed. Today
I have time to address some of your words: Thanks
for the advice! I do not need it!
That was not my intent. The words came as a result of my physician
background in response to terms like irrational fear and
depression. In
deep meditation I have experienced the Bliss and peace of the Self but only
rarely.
Meditation is natural for the one who is Self realized. There is no more
“doing” meditation. When you say
you experience peace of the Self, then please investigate as to who is feeling
the peace. If the answer is John then it is still through the medium of the body
and mind. The Self simply becomes aware of the peace or the uproar that John is
experiencing and these are changing states, quite different from the eternal
bliss, which is beyond happiness or unhappiness.
Most traditional meditation is simply the feeling of rest the mind feels
when it is being helped by lack of distraction. The weekend football watcher
feels it as much as the man who has gone fishing or the woman who is knitting
and eating chocolates. These help as long as the process is going on, and it
leaves the moment one is involved in a task that calls for doing something.
The golden key is to be able to meditate without doing anything. This
only happens to the one who is no longer identified with…I am John.
Please be prepared to shatter all your preconceived ideas about the Self.
The Self is beyond all adjectives. To know and Be the Self means to step away
permanently from all joys and sorrow that Johnwill feel after Self Realization (In Akram
Vignan) has been attained. Moments of pleasure and pain will come over John like
the clouds that cast shadows but you will be the Sun eternally above all such
clouds.
By all means, the traditional methods that you have adopted to meditate are useful, and will be
complimentary for you. The difference after Gnan will be that your meditation
will be continuous, whether you are at a tube station, or in a bus or walking
around amidst huge crowds. I
am seriously seeking and cannot be satisfied with anything less than a complete
and radical change.
Your earnestness is
noted. The Self has been your constant companion all your life and you have not
been awakened to this dearest of all friends, He is within you, knowing you more
than you can ever know him. His love for you is unconditional and non
judgmental. When you stop all
external seeking, He will arise within you as the real You. As long as you are
seeking radical changes, He will elude you. Yet if this search is spiritual in
nature it will lead you to one who will free you. This One is that which lights
this inner lamp within you. Also,
to say that it is going to take time to have an insight or to awaken seems to be
the lazy mans excuse for remaining asleep! Quite true. There is
no more time left for the one who is yearning to awaken. Those who say the above
do not know about enlightenment. Thinking is not needed for realization. It
simply happens. Those who think a lot fall on their own feet and run into major
hurdles in spiritual science. I
need a realised teacher to help me break through. Yes. Without such a
One, it is not possible. There are such masters, who liberate you from your own
bondage. Liberation is very easy. Meeting such a One is very rare. Surely
Pure Consciousness is there somewhere behind the noise of thought? The Pure
Consciousness, The Self, is aware of all thoughts, feelings and noise…eternally
unperturbed and free. To Be That is your birthright. Thank you for
providing us your details. How far are you from London? With Obeisance to The
Divine within John. shuddha P.S.
The following link has more answers to issues on Gnan: http://www.dadashri.org/satsangdada.html Dear Shuddha, I felt a connection with what you wrote...almost
like I knew what you stated...then why did I e-mail you to begin
with?!! "O.K. give up your search"....How can we
give up something that is so deeply ingrained in us ...like believing
that Truth is like knowledge and has to come as a result of work or at the end
of a search? Evolution and thousands of years of conditioning
have led us to believe in rituals, "doing" meditation so as to spiritualise
ourselves and so much more rubbish. You come along and say "stop" and what
am I to do? Please tell me where the Dr. will be in London
on the dates you mentioned and hopefully give me a Telephone no. to arrange a
contact. Perhaps I do not need the Dr. as you seem to be
able to help me to come to an understanding? Of what use is meditation when there is always
this effort to realise during the practice? What am I to do? I cannot help
wanting to break through...this searching does not lead to peace or
love. Thank you, John Dear John: In
answer to your points... "O.K. give up your search"....How can we give up
something that is so deeply ingrained in us All human beings are in fact
seeking. Most do not know it. They are all
seeking for that kind of joy and happiness, which never leaves. To
this end they go after that which they think will never leave. But it does.
Nothing in this relative worldly life is permanent. One knows it and yet one has
no choice except to pursue it. Only after finding, and being established in the
Bliss of The Self, all running away from
pain and all running towards
pleasure stops. You are quite right. This search is
deeply ingrained in all human beings. The ones who finally arrive at the
understanding that what one is seeking is not out there then one has arrived at the door
of The Self. …like believing
that Truth is like knowledge and has to come as a result of work or at the end
of a search? Truth is beyond knowledge. It is the
experience. It cannot be put into words. It resides in the heart of the awakened
and the enlightened. It loses its sacredness in all attempts to express it. It
is not acquired by effort or work or inquiry or penance or renunciation or any
attempts at doing something
spiritual. It simply happens for the one who is searching and yearning to see
and experience that which demands nothing out of you. The Lord
within. You are indeed very near to this.
You have done all that need be done to arrive at the gate to your Own Kingdom.
The door will be opened if you are receptive and ready when the moment
arrives. Evolution and
thousands of years of conditioning have led us to believe in rituals, "doing"
meditation so as to spiritualise ourselves and so much more rubbish. You
come along and say "stop" and what am I to do? Investigate whether there is any
difference in the result of your meditation with someone who tends to a rose
plant on a bright sunny morning with love and tenderness. Both result in a sense
of peace and satisfaction. There is no distraction, no selfish motive, no doing.
It is simply happening. The real you become aware of the peace that John has
experienced just as the knower
within the person who is caring for the rose plant experiences. Self realization
simply is the awakening of the one who knows
the difference. Such a One knows that peace exists in that where the
ego ceases. I am John is the ego.
I am pure Self is the absence of ego. Perhaps I do not
need the Dr. as you seem to be able to help me to come to an
understanding? I am just leading you to the gate to
your Self. The one who gives you the Gnan will open the gate. This Gnan and its
nature is well explained by Dadashri in his cardinal book Who Am I on the web. I
am sure you have read it. I remain as one of the many mahatmas of Dadashri who
facilitate the arrival at the gate. Dr. Niruben is opening this gate for
thousands in India and the few fortunate ones who meet her abroad. This science
is not for everyone. It is for those who have sought and sought and are at the
end of their journey of seeking, openly admitting that they have not found
it. It eludes the ones who think
that they know, and what they are doing, following, practicing in spiritual
matters is correct. Of what use is
meditation when there is always this effort to realise during the practice? What
am I to do? I cannot help wanting to break through...this searching does not
lead to peace or love. Indeed. Any spiritual master or
teacher who tells you to do something is not there yet. Find the one who offers
you your own Self. Find such a One who does not demand anything out of you.
There you will experience love and bliss. Then your work is done. Dadashri
represents this love and bliss. Niruben insists, and I know this as a fact, that
she is simply a medium through which Dadashri is passing on this love and bliss.
This Gnan is of The Akram Vignani. Please be aware of this momentous truth when
you receive it. Try and spend as much time with her as possible while she is in
London. Many of her followers in the UK will be most happy to help you in this
regard. With deep appreciation and love for the Pure Self in
John shuddha Dear
Shuddha, I am excited
by your answers to my questions. Can you
realise the tremendous impact this realisation via the Dr. would or could have
on my life? I do not
know what preparation would be expected of me....please inform
me. You have my
deepest heartfelt thanks for this communication. So we search
for happiness everywhere, only to find that Bliss and insight come
uninvited....and that they are really there all of the time. We take up
practices, forsake desires, often through some sense of spiritual superiority or
guilt, and we keep on believing that our
limited 'I' is there helping us to awakening when perhaps it is only the Grace
of the realised teacher that can set us free. Could it be
true ,perhaps, that Christ, Buddha, Mohammed, Shankara, Patanjali and all of the
other great ones were simply givers of Grace and that their recorded teachings
are/were only for those who, for some reason, could not receive this awakening
and knowledge of the Self directly from the teacher? How does the
Dr. give understanding? Is there some kind of diksha or repeated
mantra? There is all
of this stuff on Kundalini, Vipassana, Zen etc. and you come along and say 'no'
to all of that! Is there a
week of programs to take place in London? Please, I am still thinking in terms
of practices and systems! Thanks once
again for reading and answering. Namaste, John Dear John: I do not know
what preparation would be expected of me....please inform me. There are no preparations. And that is the beauty of it. All the
preparations have already occurred within
you. Your longing, yearning to come home to the bliss of your real Self is the preparation. The Gnani awaits
you. When you meet with Niruma, look upon her as someone who will grace and
grant you with the presence and knowledge of The Gnani Purush. Feel free with
her. Do not be restrained in any way. Ask all the questions and my sister and
others will make you feel at home. Come as you are. Come because you want to
rise above all worldly issues towards the ultimate darshan. You
have my deepest heartfelt thanks for this communication. All who have been
liberated have felt these feelings towards those who facilitate the process. I
pass them onto Dadashri, with you by my side. So
we search for happiness everywhere, only to find that Bliss and insight come
uninvited....and that they are really there all of the time. The Self is the Ocean
of Bliss. In it all rivers pour…rivers that have taken all sorts of paths. Most
remain unaware even after reaching the ocean, like the fish, which thirsts for
water. Out and away from the water, the fish struggle and gasp, back in it they
go about without a care in the world. To know
and experience that in
the presence of whom, the world cares for John and that in the absence of whom,
the world will rush to bury or cremate John, is freedom
forever. We
take up practices, forsake desires, often through some sense of spiritual
superiority or guilt, and we keep on believing The so called holy
folks, the pious and the sanctimonious, keep burdening us with what is right and
what is wrong behavior and action in this complex world. The society and the
friends around us cement upon us that by which we are judged. You will finally arrive at the place
where there is no guilt, sorrow, pleasure or pain, no distinctions and no
expectations. You will disembark from the race course of life and all its
panting and struggles for superiority and adjustments in the eyes of the world.
To be that is bliss. You will be beyond all beliefs. …that our limited
'I' is there helping us to awakening when perhaps it is only the Grace of the
realised teacher that can set us free Yes. The limited small
I is John. The eternal unlimited I will arise and awaken within you, who has
known all there is to know, and continually knows, John. This is where the
realized master comes in. Afterwards, he lets the awakened master within , the
sadguru, take over. For this awakening is permanent, life after life until final
liberation. Could it be true
,perhaps,that Christ, Buddha, Mohammed, Shankara, Patanjali and all of the other
great ones were simply givers of Grace and that their recorded teachings
are/were only for those who, for some reason, could not receive this awakening
and knowledge of the Self directly from the teacher? Yes. And Krishna and
Mahavir… their words became scriptures. They describe the candle and a million
of these descriptions will not light the candle. The live candle exists with the
Self realized teacher, and the direct interaction/communication.touch/grace… of
the teacher and disciple lights the lamp within the latter. The scriptures
reside in the intellect and the lamp of awakening resides within the heart of
the giver and the receiver. It is very precious and pure. It lets you experience
the heart of the Lords whom you have mentioned. How
does the Dr. give understanding? Is there some kind of diksha or repeated
mantra? It is
the continuation of the original experiment of separation of Dadashri, The
Original Scientist. She continues what she promised him. In this process you
will be asked to repeat the words that Dadashri used to say aloud and now she
does the same. These are sentences, which are precisely designed to establish
you in your real state and separate you from the world of John …internally. The
world will not notice a change. John’s daily life will be the same. You the real
and eternal Self within John will be free. In the state of ignorance, I am John,
is the truth. In the awakened state, I am pure Self is the
truth. Yes, to
come home is the final definition of diksha. Not to change externally or to
renounce the world. The final renunciation is the awakening as to who you
are. There
are no mantras given in the process. The mantras are for the mind. You will be
transcending all states of the mind. There is all of
this stuff on Kundalini, Vipassana, Zen etc. and you come along and say 'no' to
all of that! All rivers…leading to
the ocean. You will be taking a direct dip in the ocean. The One who is drawing
you to him, has arisen after a million years. Even amongst the spiritual experts
in India, innumerable folks are unaware of the phenomenal direct Akram approach
to the Self. Through Niruma who is on TV in Western India daily, many are coming to learn
about Dadashri. Is
there a week of programmes to take place in London? Please, I am still thinking
in terms of practices and systems! Yes. There will be
programs when Pujya Niruben comes to London. Many relate to residual questions
after the Gnan Vidhi. Many others relate to interacting with new folks. The rest
deals with being in her company and simply enjoying her company and observing
her. Language may become a factor but not for you I believe, because you will
absorb even if you do not understand. With namaskaars to the
Divine within you. shuddha Dear shuddha. Is Dr. Nirubens vidhi a diluted form of
Dadashri's? Will I have to search for another teacher after
this? As you are aware , I want to come to the end
of thesearch. and there is nothing left but to have the direct
experience of the Self through a realised
teacher. I have done everything and still there is no
profound insight or true understanding of my true nature, or even of love or the
peace that lies beyond the understanding of our ever-chaotic human
mind There MUST be a radical and profound
transformation in my life and state of consciousness...this seems to be my
Dharma and the reason for my ever changing moods which have pushed me beyond the
normal and everyday individuals life-patterns. There has been a yearning to help and heal
others for a long time, also. Without going into things or experiences too
deeply I can honestly say that I feel I may have a gift here...
these things have come back to me.
And yet, besides all of these yearnings I still
have all of the normal human desires that any man has....I have never been
able to reconcile these desires with my understanding of the sacred or my
knowledge of Truth. Love and kind thoughts, John Dear
John: At a
later time I will respond to your letter at length. In the meantime would it be
possible for you to narrate the paths and methods you have taken, worldly
teachers whom you have met so far and their effects and results upon you and
your search? With
kind regards. Jai Sat
Chit Anand Shuddha Dear shuddha, You have asked a loaded question with this
one! I have been searching for as long as I can
remember. I suppose it began with going to church when I was nine or
ten. The earliest system I learnt was T.M. and I
followed this for about two years. Here was my introduction to Bliss, Silence
and Awareness and their relationship with each other. I stopped practising T.M.
because I found that I could not help using effort as a means of achieving what
really should be an effortless state of meditation. In other words, frustration
set in with trying not to try! Also, I got tired of only having this sense of a
connection to everything around me during meditation. Using effort or
concentration still does not feel right, and the use of mantra as an effortless
method is nevertheless a method....I feel strongly that methods are not for me
and not the way. Influences have been J.Krishnamurti, Ramana
Maharshi, and much on Zen by Japanese masters. I have always had an interest in
those teachers pointing to what lies beyond thought and the limited
self. After that I learnt a system called
Samyama and have been involved with this until recently. I am certain that it
has been this which has given me an intense yearning for Truth and occasional
deep insights into Life and Being. There have been clairvoyant experiences and
lucid dreams all throughout this path but these things do not matter except that
they sometimes provide guidance or can be useful when an important decision
needs to be made. And as I have stated before, I feel there may be
some kind of healing gift within but all these things take second place
compared to my quest for understanding. There has always been a deep dissatisfaction
with life. I have always strongly felt that there may be a completely
different possibility....a perception that acts from a still, deep centre.
The trouble begins when we try to find it! Some time last year I met Bernie Prior. This guy
claims to have realised Truth. I spent a day with him in England and what he
said felt so right. He asked me how long I had been searching and I told him
"about twenty years"! I felt vibrations within in his presence and
this has been happening at night quite often since then. Dear shuddha, I hope I have adequately answered
your questions. To repeat, I cannot go on practising methods or reading books.
The Truth must take root within me and become a real, living presence, the
awareness of which is there constantly. I have done everything...meditation,
asking in prayer, reading and though I may be nearer to it now I still need a
realised teacher to show it to me. Take care Shuddha. Warmly, John Dear
John: Is
Dr. Niruben’s vidhi a diluted form of Dadashri's? No. It is the very
same vidhi of Dadashri. It
is coming to the receiver through the voice of Niruben. The container has
changed. The content is the same. The intellect plays
tricks with us when we doubt the authenticity and therefore the effect of this
Gnan Vidhi. Niruben has always maintained, just like Dadashri used to, that your
experience of the process is the testimonial. Nothing else. All worries leave,
along with all inner links to falsehood, greed, the need to be validated and
recognized, false pride, anger, expectations of praise, and continued links of
suffering because of deluded world view. Your best approach to
this Vidhi would be simply this: This is what I have
been waiting for. This is my liberation. All other methods have not helped. I am
the seeker and the receiver. I surrender all that I have learnt at the feet of
the Gnani and let Him fill my cup. I want That with which I will be deluded no
more. Will
I have to search for another teacher after this? You will stop
searching. John might search, out of old habits. There finally will come a point
where even John will come back to You, the awakened one. I
have done everything and still there is no profound insight or true
understanding of my true nature, or even of love or the peace that lies beyond
the understanding of our ever-chaotic human mind Alas… the Self eludes
those who try to do something. The mind always wants to do something. Only the
Gnani has the method by which you can be freed from the eternal shackles of the
mind. The nature of the mind is to take you away with it in contradictions and
chaos. The final solution to a mind that makes you suffer in pain and
pleasure…is to be able to understand it as it is and to know that it is simply
unfolding in front of you. To be able to see it as it is, requires for You to
arise and behold it and its film…cinema…drama…in front of you. Then you are
free. There
MUST be a radical and profound transformation in my life and state of
consciousness...this seems to be my Dharma and the reason for my ever changing
moods which have pushed me beyond the normal and everyday individuals
life-patterns. To want to change life
is not Self -realization. This inner insistence must go. The life is unfolding
as it is in front of you, and will continue to do so whether you are or not
realized. The freedom comes from the awakening within and the knowledge that
becomes your living experience…that you are not the one who is going through the
mood swings but the one who is dying…from the day he was born….changing under
the constant force of that which is happening all around. To revert to your true
nature is dharma. This is the first sentence of the Gnani Purush in his first
Aptavani of which there are now 13 volumes. Please do not expect
any change in your state of consciousness. This is a common expected projected
belief. The awakening is much more subtle within. It cannot be stated. It can
only be experienced. Self-realization is not an altered state of consciousness. It is
beyond all states of consciousness. There
has been a yearning to help and heal others for a long time, also. Without going
into things or experiences too deeply I can honestly say that I feel I may have
a gift here...these things have come back to me. In a world rampant
with strife, suffering and misery, only those who know become truly helpful. Others merely
assert their egos in the name of their god of their understanding. The inner
force of healing is the hand of The Lord within. One such hand heals hundreds of
thousands in ways, which are beyond human comprehension. ….these
things have come back to me. Life after life we all
are coming closer to our true nature…The Blessed Self within. And
yet, besides all of these yearnings I still have all of the normal human desires
that any man has....I have never been able to reconcile these desires with
my understanding of the sacred or my knowledge of Truth. For centuries
traditional religion has created this dilemma in the mind of man. What is right
and what is wrong? This is the worldly view of religion. This is not real
religion. Religion can only arise within the one who is awakened. The rest is
the religion of the one who is told what is right and what is wrong. Such a
religion imposes boundaries in the mind of man. These boundaries initiate guilt
and fear. They create further questions about the validity of such religious
doctrines. Many a religious person and head walks around bound with the
limitations of the teachings of his own scriptures, deathly afraid of admitting
his desires and punishing his body by fasting etc for negative thoughts. Man was
not meant for…”Thou shalt not…” Human birth is meant to come to know the true
nature of things and The Self. Then comes Dadashri
who in one phenomenal and momentous statement comes with this thunderbolt:
Desire is an effect. The deep inner intent (bhaav) is the real culprit, the
cause of this desire. Find the cause and then the result will come forth
naturally. To desire is not sin.
To hurt the other through thoughts, speech or acts is sin. To take advantage of
the other through falsehood is sin. And if this happens, as it will after Akram Self Realization, Dadashri has
shown the method to undo it. Anyway,
I think your sister may secretly have plans for me to act as agent/contact for
the propogation of this Truth in the U.K.....Please understand that if this
whole thing changes my life completely then I would be only too happy to
oblige. This Gnan of Dadashri
is so amazing and beautiful that many who have received it, start flying high in
the state of liberation and elation. Then after a variable time the reality sets
in as one becomes progressively established in the State of The Self. Again
please note that life will not change, the way you react to it will.
Yes, as part of the
world wide family of The Gnani Purush we all gratefully welcome your unfolding
life… in furthering his Vignan. With
gratitude for this satsang… and a sense of oneness with you… shuddha Dear Shuddha, There is such a direct wisdom regarding your
answers that I gather a great deal of peace from. You say that after Gnan there is no higher state
of consciousness and that the state is beyond that. Every religion and system of meditation I have
ever heard of advocates that through a particular practice or code of morality
one ascends to higher consciousness. These beliefs are probably embedded in the
very psyche of man stretching right back to the beginning of time itself....so
forgive me if I am still entangled in this mindset! After Gnan can any effort by ourselves deepen
the process insight or unfoldment or am I still thinking in terms of a deluded
world view? Surely this Self arising during the real state of unforced
meditation after Gnan has nowhere to go but deeper into itself?
If this is so then there are parallels here with
the Buddhist view of no self (can you explain this concept?) and of
returning to the void , ultimately. Thank you once again dear friend,
John Dear John: Thank you for sharing with me the history of your
spiritual quest. The following is only a partial response to your letter. On the issues of Samyama and Kriya Yoga
I came across the following words on the web under google search
for these two disciplines and thought it might help us both to apply our
experience and hence enhance our satsang. If you use God as the object of concentration and
contemplation, you will absorb so much of his Divine energy, his Divine Bliss,
Love and Holy Spirit - that finally you may enter Samadhi or even Nirbikalpa
(Nirvikalpa) Samadhi, a condition of complete Oneness with God while still
having a physical body. The
problem is the need to focus and concentrate on that which is unknown. How can
one enter that which he has never known or experienced? Those who talk about
such lofty things as Nirvikalp Samadhi in this manner are delusional. The mind
with its incessant vibrations simply cannot be stilled. Those who have tried it
know better than to say so. Temporary abeyance of mind activity is not true
samadhi. Samadhi means to be unaffected internally from all that the mind is
going through, pain or pleasure, peace or chaos. Love of such a Divine
nature and purity only comes from God and can only be experienced when finally
returned to God. He is our origin and our destination. But he wants us to return
on our own. Because we are of Divine nature and origin, we are free souls. Free
to do whatever pleases us. All we need to learn, is to do what pleases all
others as well, so we are never causing any Karma that may temporarily prevent
us from going home immediately by the end of this incarnation. Half truth above. Whether we do bad or good we are
continuously causing karma. Until one realizes and experiences The Self, there
is no liberation. Deep within every
human being vibrates the very Divine light of God that we are made of. We are
made to his image. Out of him, out of his holy spirit. Nothing on earth or
anywhere else can be made of anything else than of this Divine vibration. Half truth above, again. The Divine Light within
simply is. The visible image is our worldly self, made of karmic particles,
which cease to exist at death and carry forward into another body in next life
as a causal body. The Holy Spirit is simply the Self that is realized. The term
Holy is still given in relative context. God gave us the
freedom to be his children made to his image, including all his Divine power. We
are here on earth to learn make proper, loving and wise use of this Divine
power. We all are here to learn to become true and awakened - grown up -
children of God and to stay with God forever if we want so and have learned to
do so. This is the point of view of relative religion,
which places God above us and let Him guide us. It is fine as long as one
adheres to this exactly in life. This is OK for those who do not seek to know
and experience God and are content to meet him on a Sunday morning
appointment. The same
as above applies to all other "things" he created for whatever reason and
purpose. All is made out of his holy spirit, out of him. And all will one day
return to him. All is made of his Divine holy spirit !!! Strive to understand
this. Pray to God to help you to clearly understand it and he certainly will do
so. A
million such prayers will not result in the establishment of the Holy Spirit
within. Yes, a single such prayer will show him the path of goodness and worldly
peace. Kind
regards shuddha Dear shuddha, I agree with you on many of the points
raised. The reason I first began to study Eastern
teachings was because I found them not so limiting on an intellect that really
wanted to go deeply into the whole question of Truth. Holy Spirit, God etc. are less preferable words
than Pure Consciousness, Brahman, Jhana, Dhyana, etc. now, and I find that often
a common ground can be established between some of the more profound teachings
of both Vedanta and Buddhism by resorting to these words. Of course, I have seen that the intellect does
not have any use now, or at least I am in between a world of endless doubts and
questions on one hand, and the need for the direct experience that may well
shatter all of my illusions somewhat. Patanjali's stages, beginning at first with
correct moral attitude and ending with the lofty achievement of
Samadhi have probably prevented many an earnest aspirant
from knowing the Self. I have seen that Patanjali was
not advocating a progressive, time-governed path to realisation,
yet this is how he is often being
interpreted.....we have both known of cases where Self-Realisation have occurred
without following any of Patanjali's precepts! Other gurus state that the awakening of the
Third Eye brings one into contact with both the inner and outer Guru...surely
this means the same as the state of separation that occurrs after the
Gnan? Dear shuddha, my questions to you are endless
but I guess you cannot dislike answering them too much because you would have
told me where to get off by now! God Bless... John Dear
John: Greetings.
Your questions help me as much as they may help you. This is because we both are
talking about our real Self, the unending Ocean of Bliss. Every moment in that
State reaps great benefits and raises the level of that energy which does not
need anything worldly for its support or function. You
say that after Gnan there is no higher state of consciousness and that the state
is beyond that. Gnan is awakening to
that which is non-self (worldly awareness) and that which is the Self. The
awakened one is deluded no more. This awakening sees the clear distinction
between that which is constantly changing and the Self, the eternal Observer of
all that is in front. The entire film of John is being watched by You. This film
is very interesting to watch, because it has both external worldly interaction
components and the internal ones that deal with issues of the residual ego,
intellect of John, citta of John, and the mind of John. The awakened One is now
the awakened observer of even the subtlest vibrations of passion, anger, deceit
and false pride. An interesting new role starts for the One who is liberated,
for this One becomes the sadguru and the only friend of John. Other Gnanis have
called this the fourth state…Turiya. The others are worldly sleep, worldly
alertness, dream states etc. Environs and food, e.g. medicines and alcohol
effects, affect these latter three. The Gnani Purush
bestows this State and exact understanding of His instructions and satsang makes
further progression to higher and higher levels an automatic internal scientific
process. Every
religion and system of meditation I have ever heard of advocates that through a
particular practice or code of morality one ascends to higher
consciousness. Correct. The highest
state of consciousness still is limited by the mind. The traditional disciplined
approach leads one higher and higher, if indeed these disciplines are followed
and most are very rigorous. Such an aspirant however, is consciously aware that
he, John is the doer of these disciplines and the higher he arises the heavier
the ego becomes as obvious benefits of such disciplines become evident to him
and those around. A few amongst such seekers are able to purify their ego with
each successive rise in the chosen spiritual discipline, but Self expresses in
these cases only when the last remnant of the ego is gone. In Akram one is given
the Self first, and then with that enlightened worldview the rest is left to
flow along its natural course. These
beliefs are probably embedded in the very psyche of man stretching right back to
the beginning of time itself....so forgive me if I am still entangled in this
mindset True. The sense of
doer ship is ingrained in man from infinite lives and is confirmed by the world
with which he interacts. So many circumstances have to be right and exact for a
task to occur but without a thought he assumes that he indeed has done it. Even
the most astute and accomplished master of meditation will not be able to do so
if he has a nagging cold, headache or joint pains or a letter from a lawyer
demanding damages. So on the days he is able to go into deep states of
tranquility he will project that he was able to do so, and on these other days he will
blame his cold or the lawyer. After
Gnan can any effort by ourselves deepen the process of insight or unfoldment or
am I still thinking in terms of a deluded world view? After Gnan your real
effort will commence. The term effort is a misnomer but is used for a lack of
better term for the word: purushaarth.
The worldly efforts cease and true internal endeavor commences
naturally. You the awakened One arises as a purush from the complex of thoughts
speech and acts which the world identifies as John and the other name for it is
prakruti. Both in fact are on auto
pilot. As Your interference in
John’s prakruti progressively decreases, Your will rise higher and higher as The
Self. This is upheld by applied understanding of The Agnas of The Gnani, which
will be given to you after the Gnan Vidhi. So in one short
sentence the only thing that remains to be done is to be faithful to the Agnas
of The Gnani. Agna means a simple instruction, received and fulfilled as a
promise. It has no worldly intent. It is designed uniquely by The Gnani to
ensure your final liberation from the cycles of birth and death. Surely
this Self arising during the real state of unforced meditation after Gnan has
nowhere to go but deeper into itself? Not quite. The Gnan
Vidhi has no parallel in our infinite life after life history. It is not an
unforced meditation. It is the meeting of the seeker who wants to be liberated
and the Giver of such liberation. The liberator has the key. The one who is
bound is asking for the release. The Self simply is… in all. It is there in all
its glory and splendor and magnificence. It is by nature blissful. It never was
and will never be bound. It is the veils of karma that obstruct the view and
experience. It is like the sun and the clouds. The sun simply is. The clouds of
pleasure and pain, life and death come and go. The clouds affect the one who is
watching all this from the ground. Such a seeker has to constantly look for
moments of sunshine. The awakened One is beyond and above all clouds. Gnan places the seeker
above the clouds and finally as the radiant sun… eternally free. If
this is so then there are parallels here with the Buddhist view of no self (can
you explain this concept?) and of returning to the void , ultimately. Agree if you use the
small s for the self. The Self is. The Self can instantly visualize and relive
the day when John first went to school with mom or dad, and explore with great
detail each vivid scene in remote past. And in the case of enlightened ones The
Self can see many many previous lives. These moving scenes can only be seen if
there was a present unmoving Observer. Yes from the
perspective and vantage of the Self everything is void, because it changes and
perishes and goes away. The One who says I am void has to deal with the term
…am. The one who stops proclaiming still remains… to go over to the next life
and the next body, which is in front of him. Mahavir asserted the
positive Self as the Self, negating everything else as the non-self. He became
the fully enlightened living Self. Buddha in his enlightenment reached lofty
heights transcending the highest layers of intellect stopping short of
experiencing The eternal Self described by Mahavir. Buddha called the Self,
momentary. This lack of the eternal attribute to the Self leaves a void in
Buddhist line of thought with explanation of what carries on life after life.
This is why despite having its origin in India; this great religion has not had
much of a following in India. This question of yours
has intrigued me also for some time, and I guess I will know the final answer
when I have attained what these two great human beings have… within their inner
world. My experience so far, obviously very limited, brings forth the statements
made above. What
of the sleep state itself? Does the Self remain even in that, or is this a
process of
in
every state, whether waking/sleeping, working/resting, eating/drinking
etc.? Who knows that you had
a good sleep when you wake up after a good night of sleep? The one that was in
deep sleep does not know what kind of sleep it was. The one who was awake even
in deep sleep is The Self. Likewise this Self has been your eternal companion
life after life in all activities of life and it is in this great life through
the medium of John you are now ready to see the face of this Lord within you…
full of unconditional love…the greatest of all friends. One glimpse and all your
doubts will vanish. At
His Feet shuddha Dear shuddha, Thankyou but more! J. Krishnamurti describes real meditation as
"the state where the observer and the observed are one". Is this Turiya
? Also, the Akram Vignan website describes methods
for dealing with anger, avoiding clash and all kinds of advice regarding how we
should live life. Having received the Atma Gnan, surely the result
from then on is purification and even the gradual dissolution of
every construct of the small self? Do we not become a light unto ourselves
then? Must we cling to the moral advice of Dadashri,
when at last we are aware of the impermanence of all phenomena, including
desires, emotions etc.? These moral teachings, for me, are reminiscent
of the Ten Commandments....a code of life for the unitiated.Surely the
Jnani/Gnani has gone beyond the need for these? Dear shuddha, it is knowledge/direct
experience of the absolute reality of the Self that must be acquired....this
must be the only way to freedom? Must I, before and after Gnan, make an oath to
abide by these devotional tenets of A.V. when my thirst is for the experience of
the Truth of the Self? Thankyou, John Dear
John: In
response to you questions highlighted below, please note that there is no intent
to slight JK but to simply dissect what he says with reference to what we have been
discussing…and from my view as I behold it. J.
Krishnamurti describes real meditation as "the state where the observer and the
observed are one”. Is this Turiya ? Let us study the
following words of Krishnamurti copied and pasted from the website called
kfa.org: “Freedom is not a
reaction; freedom is not a choice. It is man’s pretense that because he has
choice he is free. Freedom is pure observation without direction, without fear
of punishment and reward. Freedom is without motive; freedom is not at the end
of the evolution of man but lies in the first step of his existence. In
observation one begins to discover the lack of freedom. Freedom is found in the
choiceless awareness of our daily existence and activity. “Thought is time.
Thought is born of experience and knowledge, which are inseparable from time and
the past. Time is the psychological enemy of man. Our action is based on
knowledge and therefore time, so man is always a slave to the past. Thought is
ever-limited and so we live in constant conflict and struggle. There is no
psychological evolution. “When man becomes
aware of the movement of his own thoughts, he will see the division between the
thinker and thought, the observer and the observed, the experiencer and the
experience. He will discover that this division is an illusion. Then only is
there pure observation which is insight without any shadow of the past or of
time. This timeless insight brings about a deep, radical mutation in the
mind. “Total negation is
the essence of the positive. When there is negation of all those things that
thought has brought about psychologically, only then is there love, which is
compassion and intelligence. If I may
take the liberty to expand on what this thinker has said, please note the
3rd paragraph above. This entire paragraph confirms that what he is
talking about is essentially related to the mind, and has no connection to
enlightenment or freedom of Self as I know it. If you ask a man who becomes
aware of his thoughts the simple question, ‘who are you, the answer will be, ‘I
am John, of course’. So it is
not surprising to me that the gentleman is making divisions within the mind
itself and therefore coming out
with the conclusion that this division is an illusion. He simply never arrived
at the level, which we have been talking about.
Freedom is pure
observation without direction… In observation one
begins to discover the lack of freedom. His mind is playing
tricks with him…and all those who swallow his words…. What he
used to say appealed to the intelligentsia a lot, only to return empty handed
after the discussion. Deep thinkers are far from liberation. Krishnamurti did
not believe in the need for a guru. Enlightenment is not possible without a
liberator guru. This is because the ego is the final substrate of the mind and
it needs to dissolve, before one can see the tricks the mind plays within. The
Observer and the Observed can never be one. How can the mirror ever become one
with that which is reflected in it? In fact when Self –realization is attempted
from the medium of the intellect this is precisely what happens. Chaos. Here is
something more to discuss openly about from his book: “ Freedom from all
belief?” " First of all, authority in so-called
spiritual matters is really nonspiritual. I think that must be clear and must be
understood deeply. There is no authority in man’s endeavor to find out if there
is that ultimate truth. The authority of a priest, of all the religions, is
based on hearsay, on propaganda, on conditioning the mind to believe in certain
saviors, masters, and so on. Because, one has to be a light to oneself and you
cannot possibly light your light from another.” Agree totally. Except when it comes
to the Gnani Purush. Such a one is no one’s a master or a guru. The One who
liberates you from eternal bondage is very very rare indeed. What JK is talking
about above is a hundred percent true about worldly gurus, because they
themselves are not free and do not have the light we have been talking about.
Such worldly gurus are not free from their own internal enemies. These are the
very ones who insist on a certain code, commandment and follow up
behavior. Because, one has to be a light to
oneself and you cannot possibly light your light from another.” Alas, for infinite
life times man has tried this and fallen on his face. This is precisely the role
of the buddhi, the intellect within the brain. The sentence is perfectly true
after the lamp has been lit.
Unfortunately such sentences coming from famous persons throw a clinker in the
minds of those who are simply yearning to come to the source. Also,
the Akram Vignan website describes methods for dealing with anger, avoiding
clash and all kinds of advice regarding how we should live
life. Having
received the Atma Gnan, surely the result from then on is purification and even
the gradual dissolution of every construct
of the small self? Do
we not become a light unto ourselves then? Must
we cling to the moral advice of Dadashri, when at last we are aware of the
impermanence of all phenomena, including desires, emotions
etc.? These
moral teachings, for me, are reminiscent of the Ten Commandments....a code of
life for the unitiated.Surely the Jnani/Gnani has gone beyond the need for
these? I am pleased that you
have raised these questions, which have a common theme. Please note that when
the Gnani moved about in this world, thousands of ordinary folks from all walks
of life met him. Not all of them desired liberation. Many just had no concept or
ideas of liberation. Most were deeply involved in their worldly affairs and had
never even given any thoughts to other issues in life. Most were however very
aware of issues of anger, strife, misunderstandings, clash, negative passions,
deceit etc. He used to open up a wide variety of general talks and let the
person in front of him answer and thereby start asking the relevant inner questions. All left, after
meeting him with something. Some acquired the knowledge of the Self. Most heard
him and gained some simple techniques of how to attain harmony at home and in
inter personal relationships. These simple keys are universally applicable and
one does not need to be Self realized to apply them. Many who applied these simple words of
his in daily living saw the practical benefits and came back for the Real thing.
With That, there remained no conflicts or instructions to follow. Yes there is a moral
tone and ethical code of conduct, which the Gnani openly suggests and it is
summarized in simple terms. If you are seeking worldly pleasures and comforts,
give the same to others. If you give to others pain and misery, misery for you
will be the end result. If you want to escape from the endless cycles of
pleasure and pain related conduct, know The Self. For the One who
receives The Gnan of The Self, there is nothing more left except the following
of the Agnas of The Gnani Purush. The Self is no longer the doer of
anything. John’s conduct
unfolding after Gnan, which may well hurt others is adjusted as John comes
nearer and nearer to The Awakened Self, You. Yes, The Light is then
lit within to see the futility of all efforts in endless corrective mode. This
light is the Guiding Light of John. Dear
shuddha, it is knowledge/direct experience of the absolute reality of the
Self that must be acquired....this must be the only way to
freedom? You already have an
answer to this one. You have tried all ways otherwise and you know where you
are. Look at Krishnamurti. Would you like to be like him? Look at Osho…would you
like to be like him? Or Look at the face of
The Lord Jesus or Buddha or Mahavira… Ramana or Dadashri …would you like to
experience what they have? The mind of man plays
infinite tricks. You know the above experience is within you. The Gnani simply
opens the door. Only the One who has the key can do so. Only the one who has
been there can do it for you. The Knowledge of The
Self is freedom. There is no other freedom. All else is bondage. I think the key is to
stop clinging afterwards once the door has been opened. Yes, absorb every word
of his, but after that He can do no more for you. His Gnan then is your constant
companion, sadguru and caretaker. ….this
must be the only way to freedom? There is never an
absolute answer in the relative world. We all, at the feet of The Gnani Purush
can only apprise you of what we know. Sure there are many other ways, but these
traditional methods are no longer relevant for this era, and are very arduous.
They require very disciplined approaches and are therefore tough. They have
existed for centuries. Their relevance in these times is very limited and the
only ones who are clinging to them are the so-called gurus and those validated
by them, who trade upon it. Must
I, before and after Gnan, make an oath to abide by these devotional tenets of
A.V. when my thirst is for the experience of the Truth of the
Self? No. There is no
commandment or order or oath before or after. These would come from a worldly or
a relative guru, never from a Gnani Purush.
The Gnani gives you five simple sentences; in fact he calls them
sentences. These are designed to uphold what you have gained in the process of
separation and to liberate you forever from all entanglements in the universe.
If you wish to sustain the experience gained in the Gnan Vidhi, these sentences
will be there for you… despite all games played by the intellect. Jai
Sat Chit Anand shuddha Dear shuddha, One major query, dear friend and guide! So my restless mind is becoming more and more attuned to
some of the theory behind A.V., thanks to your explanations. What about this one? I have discovered that there is a state beyond the fourth
(Turiya) written of in the more profound Vedantic teachings and my inquiry into this was triggered by some vague
intuitive sense that there could possibly be a danger in the seeker clinging to this belief that God is in
him/her. Of course, as you have previously pointed out, with Turiya
having been attained after Gnan ....this is the beginning of the real
search....Turiya is indeed a rare attainment and teachers have said it is
acquired only after long periods of meditation and even then, to the fortunate
few. It has been stated that Turiya leads to a state called
Turiyatita, the fifth state, which occurs "When the witness(The Self) dissolves
into everything that is witnessed, and there is the pure non-dual
realisation of One Taste" Now, some of those God-realised teachers have stated that
the watcher and the watched, the observer and the observed etc., at the higher
stages become one....and that this is real meditation. Now Dadashri comes along and shakes one's whole world up
with the irrevocable and undeniable experience of the Self...one is never the
same after this...the reality has dawned. Now the danger is that this profound
insight is assumed to be the end of the quest for ultimate
truth. It seems that, from what we have just said, that there are
even more profound insights to be had. Now, I have read that in the higher stages of Samadhi
thought actually ceases, sometimes along with the breath, and consciousness is experienced as all there
is. My question to you was something along the lines of "After
Gnan can we deepen the state of insight gained by our own efforts?" In other
words, can we somehow let Turiya unfold into Turiyatita? Enough said! Take Care, Warmly, John Dear
John: In response to
your multiple queries... I have
discovered that there is a state beyond the fourth (Turiya) written of in the
more profound Vedantic teachings and my
inquiry into this was triggered by some vague intuitive sense that there could
possibly be a danger in the
seeker clinging to this belief that God is in him/her. Words and
definitions sometimes create confusion. Especially when it relates to
description of that which can never be expressed. How can I express my Real
nature to you? I can only express what I feel through the medium of my mind and
language skills, essentially a limiting factor. Yet those who seek liberation
and those who have risen higher and higher on varying planes of consciousness
still find that they are in bondage because they are rising higher
within
the mind. Rare is the person who shatters for once and all the final
chain of bondage to find that all seeking was within the mind and there is no
more seeking left. There is only the seeker left but He the Awakened One is now
the Seer of this seeker…who still is trying to validate his worldly concepts of freedom, his
ideas of bliss. Yet this like everything else that is relative dies its natural
death after the awakening. Most of what is in Vedanta is summarized in
the simple sentence….Not this, not this. Neti Neti. This is the end of Vedanta. The Self
is where This is it …I am That… begins.
Hence the obvious rare state of turiya. The world in ignorance is living in the
awake, sleep and dream states. It considers all that as real. To the Gnani all
of it is a dream, relative, transient, and dying. The Real awakening has
commenced. Yet, despite being awake he still is confronted by the world and the
unfolding of the karma caused in the past life… Ramana has sarcoma of the arm,
Dadashri had a hip fracture that made him bed ridden for 6 months, not to
mention all that unfolds in front of mahatmas (Self Realised beings of Dadashri)
after Gnan. This is the carryover of past life karma unfolding their effects in
this life. When the final remnant of karma unfolds and leaves…the
turiyatita…above triya state has arrived and this is the state of the final
moksha or liberation …no cause is left to return to a body in this universe. The
Self blends and becomes One with the Universal Self and the entire universe is
The Self. Dadashri has not used the
term turiya. He simply uses the following three terms and makes it simple for us
all. He is the most practical Gnani cutting through all mazes and fences and
gives us our Self in all its pristine glory. He is the greatest of all
spiritual scientists because he
is able to do so…give you your
Self. Other Gnani’s have merely shown the techniques. None that I know have led
one by the hand beyond this cosmic bondage. The terms
are: Moodhatma…the
ignorant self. The one who goes about in the world saying, I am John, This is my
reality, my world. Shuddhatma…
the absolute pure Soul…shuddha means absolutely pure, Atma…Soul. The
awakened One now will be established in the state that I am absolutely pure.
Even a millionth slice of me is pristine and pure, untainted and unaffected by
even the most ghastly acts or thoughts of John…in this or infinite previous life
times. John continues to say I am John, but the awakening has happened, within.
The separation of Akram Vignan. Parmatma…
The Fully Enlightened Being. The Lord of the 14 worlds, the Lord of The
Universe…God in All His Glory. The Supreme Reality. All worldy
meditation on the physical plane is within the sphere of moodhatma. The one who
feels tranquil after TM or Vipassana, goes to a bar one evening and feels good.
Both states are in the realm of the dream world. Both require action. There is a
constant sense of doership. The sense I am John never leaves. The ego simply
exists as I am John. Shuddhatma
state is the State after Gnan or Self realization. This is synonymous with
living moksha, liberated while living, turiya. The Observer of it all is
awakened. The interim state of the 2nd phase of the moon, on
autopilot slowly arising as The Self to the full moon state of Param atma…The
Absolute State of The Self, final liberation. The transition from the shuddhatma
state to parmatma state is facilitated by the five sentences of Dadashri. There
is no effort needed in this transition. Only an Exact Understanding Of The
Science. Now, some
of those God-realised teachers have stated that the watcher and the watched, the
observer and the observed etc., at the higher stages become one....and that this
is real meditation. Meditation as defined by
Dadashri has essentially four categories. Dhyan means meditation. Artadhyan
Raudradhyan
Dharmadhyan
Shukladhyan The first two are adverse
meditation. If one is burning up from within by negativities such as jealousy,
fear, depression, anxiety, disturbances of wide varieties, then this state of
meditation is artadhyan. There is no spillover of this state to another being
and is essentaily hurting the individual only. Raudradhyan is the sate
where internal adverse effects spillover and hurts another being as well. Like
anger, deceit, violence in words, revenge planning, bad mouthing someone,
defaming another human being, plans for hurting others etc. These two represent
disturbances. Both of these bind negative karma for future life. Artadhyan leads to lower life forms like
birds and animal birth. Raudradhyan leads to deeper stages of living hell. Both
cause unrest and anguish within. When the state is one of
positive state, there is absence of the two above. There is the desire to see
others happy and to help others in misery. In doing so one’s own negativity is
absent. This leads one progressively towards the positive for all humanity. This
is the message of all traditional religion. This is dharmadhyan.
All three above are
occurring in all human beings spontaneously as their karma unfold. It is a
fallacy to think that one is doing them. Yet for the unenlightened it is true
that he is doing them and hence he has to suffer the consequences as well. And finally there is
shukladhyan. This is the State of the Self. The awakened One becomes the knower
and the seer. This is where the mediation is spontaneous and bliss is
continuous. The Observer is separate from that which is in front, the thoughts,
the intellect, the citta, the residual discharging ego, the sensations, the
desires, the pains, the pleasures….the world of beings outside. The Observer can
never become one with the observed. It is not scientific. The observed is
temporary. The Observer is permanent.
All other ideas are within the mind only. All other observations arise
from within the mind and terminate with the mind. In Akram, the Observer is
awakened and this awakening is permanent. The Observer, the Knower & Seer of
John and his world is there permanently detached and progressing towards final
liberation. Now
Dadashri comes along and shakes one's whole world up with the irrevocable and
undeniable experience of the Self...one is never the same after this...the
reality has dawned. Now the danger is that this profound insight is assumed to
be the end of the quest for ultimate truth. Dadashri not
only gives but lets you experience that which had eluded you life after life,
the ultimate truth. The Self. There is no danger in The Self. All danger exists
in the non-Self. It seems
that, from what we have just said, that there are even more profound insights to
be had. Indeed. Does the moon do
anything from the sickle shape 2nd day appearance to the full moon
illumination? The profound vision is a better word, for insight relates to the
mind… simply grows and illuminates the gross, subtle, and the subtlest stains on
the mirror of The Self…the worldly faults of John…. and wipes them with love and
understanding. Now, I
have read that in the higher stages of Samadhi thought actually ceases,
sometimes along with the breath, and
consciousness is experienced as all there is. What use is
such a samadhi to you or others around you? This is for those who are yearning
to liberate on the physical plane. Dadashri calls this handle samadhi. You have
to turn the handle to make the machine work. This type of samadhi has nothing to do
with self-realization. They only represent changes in the states of
consciousness. Awareness is above consciousness. Awareness is persistent
awakening to reality. My
question to you was something along the lines of "After Gnan can we deepen the
state of insight gained by our own efforts?" In other words, can we somehow let
Turiya unfold into Turiyatita? Yes. That is
all that needs to be done. Understanding this science exactly and applying the 5
agnas of The Gnani Purush achieve that. Jai Sat
Chit Anand shuddha Dear shuddha, I am e-mailing you sometimes twice a day and
still you are patient and forthcoming with your answers.....I am
grateful. There are a great many doubts, or not quite
doubts but musings as to how to be most receptive to the Gnan when it is given.
What kind of inner preparation can I do here, perhaps as simply even just being
aware of wrong perspectives, or erroneous concepts that I have accumulated
during the search, in order to let the Gnan in, so to speak? What frame of mind and being is required in one
who truly wants understanding and the seperation of the Self from the
not-Self? Would friends, family and work colleagues be
aware that I have changed? Many around me are not aware of my interest in these
things.How is an individual to adapt in the light of such a radical change of
perspective? Will my analysing and enquiring mind not be
an impediment to the whole of the Vidhi? I read the words of Nisagardatta with interest,
and I recall reading the teachings of his teacher Ramana Maharshi a few years
ago....in the realm of God-man both his and Ramakrishna's lives were exemplary,
and I wonder how many other individuals there are like this, on the earth but
not of it? So I have already said enough! Are there any others like myself keeping you
busy....or should I say "pickling your head"? God Bless, John: Dear
John: I am
e-mailing you sometimes twice a day and still you are patient and forthcoming
with your answers.....I am grateful. The dearest of all tasks in
this world for me is that which brings me closer to my Self, and this is one of
them. The fact that it is doing the same for you is the natural
consequence. There are
a great many doubts, or not quite doubts but musings as to how to be most
receptive to the Gnan when it is given. You already are there for
its reception. You have been ever since this dialogue has commenced. For a long
time after my Gnan Vidhi I used to deliberate on the container and the contents.
The container meaning who is having/giving this Gnan and content meaning the
Gnan itself. In more recent times, it has dawned on me that it is something more
than the two. It is the inner reaction, to the two that matters. A very thirsty
being will appreciate a cool tall glass of water served in Waterford crystal,
with gratitude. In fact he would even drink it off a paper cup with thanks. The
one with a marginal thirst will take a sip of the paper cup and ditch the rest,
and may linger on the crystal ware for a while only to forget it later. Such is
the case with the container and the contents. The earnestness is with the thirst
and the water, regardless of how it is served. The sign of Atmagnan,
realization of the Self is that the thirst is quenched. There is no further
seeking from without and eternal gratitude simply exists for the one who has
quenched this thirst. This gratitude is beyond words. Indians express it by
kneeling, or even prostrating themselves at the feet of The Gnani Purush. The
external maneuvers are not important, the spontaneous ness is. There are no
conditions to it. It would be false to kneel, just because others are doing so.
The surrender that is called for is the inner surrender of the negativities of
false pride, anger and the ego which refuses to surrender where surrender is
called for… where surrender leads to peace and harmony. So then, first there is the
thirst… the awareness of bondage. Then there is the One with the Gnan… the
container. Then there is the water… The Gnan…the remedy. Then there is the
offering and the receiving of the same. Then there is the result. This is why
someone who is not thirsty or who is critical of the container is not going to
attain much even if he is in front of the original container… the One in whom
this Gnan expressed spontaneously. True spiritual thirst arises after lifetimes
of inquiry and search. Most are content with weekly Sunday school lessons from
their respective religions. Yet the Gnani pours and offers it to all who come to
his feet with equal love and devotion. In his eyes there is no distinction
between the one who is ready and the one who is not. What kind
of inner preparation can I do here, perhaps as simply even just being aware of
wrong perspectives, or erroneous concepts that I have accumulated during
the search, in order to let the Gnan in, so to speak? To cast aside all
preconceptions would be ideal. To become an empty pot would be ideal. To let it
all fill to the brim would be ideal. This has happened to some extent in our
dialogue. To know that all the methods so far were on the wrong plane would
help. They have to do with the mind, the physical self, not the real Self. They
were helpful and thus need not be discarded as useless. Not to expect some fireworks would be
great. The Gnan Vidhi is like dawn that is followed by sunrise through
understanding. What
frame of mind and being is required in one who truly wants understanding and the
separation of the Self from the not-Self? Samarpan. Surrender. Total
surrender would be ideal. The surrendering of thoughts, speech and
acts…especially on the day of The Gnan Vidhi, or the afternoon of the Vidhi and
for the 24 hours followed by the Vidhi so as to let it all sink in and take
roots. Avoidance of reading any scriptures or spiritual books during that
period, too much discussion about the process with anyone afterwards except with
Niruma on the day after. You will be encouraged to meet her on the day after to
bring forth any residual questions. To go to bed on the night following the
Vidhi as The Self. To give yourself special time for the Great Event. To apply
the Knowledge of The Self from the moment it is received. To constantly revert
to the Self as soon as possible. Would
friends, family and work colleagues be aware that I have changed? Many around me
are not aware of my interest in these things. How is an individual to adapt in
the light of such a radical change of perspective? Those around you may notice
a change in you, gradually. Some may not. It does not matter if John has changed
in the eyes of the world. It matters a whole lot if John has changed in Your
eyes. John does not have to change. How you react to John’s world will change.
John is constantly changing. Your running with John will stop. How is an
individual to adapt in the light of such a radical change of perspective? To see the Divine in all is
not radical. The Lord taught us that and was meaning to teach you precisely that
when you attended church at 10 yrs of age. Now you will have acquired His
Vision. John’s worldy life will continue as is and this Gnan does not alter any
of that. Your inner release will not be noticed much by others. You will become
aware of the worldly errors of John, and would notice that progressively you
would blame others less for obstacles and troubles in John’s life. As the inner
enemies leave, the freedom will spill over into John and then the world will
take notice. Will my
analysing and enquiring mind not be an impediment to the whole of the
Vidhi? That is why it is good that
all questions be asked and answered in advance. You will have the opportunity to
ask all your residual questions to Pujya Niruma before the Vidhi. Spiritual enquiry is
healthy. The intellect that interferes is not. The role of intellect is to
compare, find faults in the other, props the worldly ego, and by all costs avoid
the spiritual path of enlightenment. In this sense this intellect is an enemy of
the one who desires liberation. The intellect that is obedient, lets you respect
and revere the Gnani and lets you receive the Gnan is the good and the healthy
intellect. I read
the words of Nisagardatta with interest, and I recall reading the teachings of
his teacher Ramana Maharshi a few years ago....in the realm of God-man both his
and Ramakrishna's lives were exemplary, and I wonder how many other individuals
there are like this, on the earth but not of it? All the three Great Human
beings that you have mentioned were enlightened and have walked the face of this
earth to liberate or point the way to liberation. Spontaneous awakening within
man is rare and happens as the cases above, except for Sri Nisargadatta who had
a guru. Dadashri did not have a guru in this life. Ramana was not the guru of
Nisargadatta. The two never met. To be in the body and yet be totally detached
from it is the sign of an Original Gnani. Such human beings are very very rare.
To meet such a One is an extreme rarity and to know that he is such a One after
meeting him is even rare. Many such beings are recognized for their true worth
after they leave the world. Dadashri is a classic example. Now the Vignan of
Dadashri is continuing through others because of its intrinsic powers and
strength of the words of Dadashri. On closer examination, you
will find that of all the Gnani’s mentioned Dadashri stands out because he is
able to give, impart and make you
The Self. The others were not able to do so. When asked by seekers who had come
to meet them from far and wide, they would merely state that the enquiry must
continue. I state this with full humility, respect and deference to the
followers of these other Gnanis
whose devotion to them may stir some vibrations of negativity upon reading these
sentences. Are there
any others like myself keeping you busy....or should I say "pickling your
head"? Not many, like you. You are
a thirsty one. Besides, our web site is one in a trillion and we do not
advertise or pay to make it reach many more. With Kind regards, JSA shuddha Dear
shuddha, So I finally
have dates, times and venues for Gnan in London! Questions!: The Gnan is
being given on different days over a week or longer.....Can one receive this
twice? (I am thinking in terms of deepening process here). Perhaps with a week
or so apart? There is no limit on the number of times you may take Gnan. In fact,
every opportunity to sit in the Gnan Vidhi is a great blessing. Dear shuddha, Thankyou......to
continue. You have stated that the five
sentences given after Gnan Vidhi will sustain the separation that occurs as a
result of the Gnan. So these are not mantras, with any
magical power, neither are they moral commandments. It is hard for me to
understand how these sentences can have such power unless they are imbued with
some kind of energy which is a continual and potent connection to the very
source of the teachings....Dadashri? And yet they are both believed in
and upheld within the A.V. teachings. And there is not even a repetition of
these sentences needed? Please can you
elaborate? Thanks, John Dear
John: In
further clarification to your questions You
have stated that the five sentences given after Gnan Vidhi will sustain the
separation that occurs as a result of the Gnan. So
these are not mantras, with any magical power, neither are they moral
commandments. A mantra is anything
that stills the mind or tries to contain the mind, thus guiding it in a specific
direction. The 5 agna is not a mantra in this sense. The Agnas essentially
transcend the mind and does not require the mind for their applied understanding
and execution after Gnan. Magical power… eh?
This is the miracle of all miracles because it is real, and experiential and
eternal. It does not vanish like a magical trick. Moral
commandments… Moral…is a relative
word. The Self is beyond all man made ideas of morality and immorality. Commandments…. This term can only be
applied if the receiver has no choice otherwise, and the commander is some
superior who will dish out punishment if they are not followed. Perpetual Grace
is a better term for the 5 Sentences. It
is hard for me to understand how these sentences can have such power unless they
are imbued with some kind of energy which is a continual and potent connection
to the very source of the teachings....Dadashri? Exactly. There is the
energy of a Mula Purush… who walks the face of this earth, after life times of
sadhana… seeking and having arrived and attained the Infinite Bliss Of The Self
…wants to share with his fellow human beings. Our history is filled with such
beings… and Dadashri is relevant to our times. It has been merely 15 years since
his physical departure but the vibrations of his State continue to liberate
thousands….His words in Gujarati in Aptavanis and other books have profound
effects on the listener and I vouch
for that. And
yet they are both believed in and upheld within the A.V. teachings. And there is
not even a repetition of these sentences needed? Believed and
Upheld…. The issue of belief
and upholding only arises for the one who has to rely on these two. For the one
who has been seeking life after life for a drop of nectar of bliss, this is
true. What belief and supporting activity is needed for the One who is now
immersed in the Ocean of Bliss? Does
the ocean have any need to flow up the river? The nature of The Self is Bliss.
After The Gnan Vidhi, all seeking stops naturally, because one has come home.
What is left is the dying intellect factor. Its demise is inversely proportional
to the increasing bliss of The Self. Dadashri
has used the example of the water in his book who am I? If you want to heat a
quantity of water, what would you do? Answer: Light a fire underneath the vessel. And
if you want to cool that water what would you do? Answer of many: add ice etc. Dadashri’s answer:
Nothing…go to bed and in the am it would be cool. Why? It is the intrinsic nature of water to
come to its normal state. Likewise, the self is constantly seeking the Self. The
constant activity of karma… not the mind, is the impediment. In fact ignorance
of this knowledge is the impediment. And karma is the result of ignorance of the
knowledge of The Self. And
there is not even a repetition of these sentences needed? No. Repetition is only
for the ones who have not arrived yet. Repetition is only for those who want to
try for liberation or wanting to achieve a desired worldly result. When one
surrenders to the Gnani there is no work left. Only the bliss of continued
unraveling of The Self. Kind
Regards & Happy Easter shuddha your
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Jai Sat Chit Anand Last update: May 02, 2003
The Awareness of the Eternal is Bliss.